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Posted on Dec 31, 2023, 9:01 pm
#1
Hey LLers,

I’ve been lurking on these forums for almost two years. It has been an incredibly useful resource towards my decision on if and how to lengthen.

In April 2024, I will have a bilateral lengthening surgery with Dr. Giotikas in Athens using the weight-bearing G-Nail to lengthen my femurs by 5cm. I’m sharing this diary with as much detail and data as I can in case it’s useful for others who are considering the surgery.

Motivation
My height puts me at the 25th percentile in my country. I struggle to consistently be confident and outgoing due to a frequent preoccupation with height, which hinders my social wellbeing. I believe being raised (literally) to average height combined with therapy will lead to an improved self-perception and a more fulfilling life.

Stats
Basics: 29, Male, European
Starting height: 171cm (target after surgery: 176cm)
Wingspan: 176cm
Weight: 76kg (target before surgery: 73kg)
Fitness:
  • 5k pace: 4:30 min/km
  • 10k pace: 4:45 min/km
  • Squat: 115 kg 1RM
  • RDL: 130 kg 1RM
  • Bench press: 80 kg 1RM

Operation
I have the following constraints for the operation:
  • Low risk of complications.
  • Maintain normal proportions.
  • Eventually get back to 90% of my current fitness level.
  • Get back to walking as soon as possible.
  • Europe based.

Which resulted in the following decisions:
  • Length: 5cm as my femurs are already slightly disproportionate to my tibias, and the moderate length will lead to a shorter turnaround time and higher likelihood of getting back to my previous fitness level. Depending on my perception after the surgery, I would consider lengthening a “safe” amount (4cm) on my tibias in ~2 years to reach 180cm and better proportions.
  • Surgeon: Dr. Giotikas as he’s one of the most experienced surgeons in Europe, and there are multiple successful diary entries in this forum. He has been empathetic, patient and informative in our consultations so far.
  • Nail: G-Nail looks to be the most reliable weight-bearing nail in the market right now. My understanding is that a weight-bearing nail will cause less muscle atrophy and lead to faster recovery compared to an NWB nail. The downside is the clicking mechanism which is more complex and stressful.

Expected timeline
  • -90 days (now) - Start preparation
  • -3 days - Go to Athens
  • +0 days - Operation
  • +7 days - Distraction phase and PT begins
  • +30 days - Work remotely while doing PT
  • +57 days - Consolidation phase begins
  • +60-90 days - Go back to home city with less frequent PT
  • +120 days - Walk is mostly back to normal
  • +150 days - Consolidation phase ends
  • + 360 days - Rods removal
  • + 375 days - Can gradually resume intense activities (running, tennis)
  • + 620 days - (potentially) Start lengthening 4cm on tibias

Preparation
Stretching: Quads, hamstrings, hip adductors, IT band stretch routine in the mornings & evenings.

Gym: Resistance training twice a week to maintain muscle mass. I have large thigh muscles so I'm unsure if it’s best to let those muscles atrophy before the surgery or keep them to maintain strength.

Equipment & supplements:
  • Collagen (muscle, bone and skin)
  • Glucosamine (joint and soft tissue)
  • Whey (protein)
  • Omega-3 (anti-inflammatory)
  • Curcumin (anti-inflammatory)
  • Multivitamin: B, C, D, Zinc, K2
  • Melatonin and Magnesium Bisglycinate (sleep)
  • CBD (pain management & sleep)
  • Compression sleeves (circulation)
  • Mattress topper (sleep)
  • Laptop & Oculus (entertainment)
  • Yoga mat and stretching belt (home stretching)
  • Grabber tool
  • Hot & cold packs

Would love advice on what else to consider.

Recovery
I plan to stay 4 weeks in either the Grand Hyatt or Novotel in Athens and the remaining 4+ weeks in an Airbnb. It would be great to hear experiences from other patients that have stayed in Athens regarding accommodation. I’m also unsure whether to hire a caretaker or not.

Estimated costs
  • Surgery: €48,900
  • Rod removal: €4,200
  • Accommodation: €100 euro * 60 days = €6,000
  • Food: €50 * 60 days = €3,000
  • Plane tickets: €300
  • Ground transportation: €500
Total: €62900

Next posts
I’ll try to capture in my follow-up posts:
  • Pre-op blood work & x-rays.
  • Surgery experience.
  • Recovery experience & videos.
  • Post-recovery blood work & x-rays.

Let me know what other information would be useful.
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Posted on Jan 2, 2024, 3:38 pm
#2
I'll see u there bud. Mine is scheduled for end of Febuary. Gnail femurs as well  Dr. Giotikas 5cm bilateral femurs with G-Nail (detailed)
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Posted on Jan 2, 2024, 4:09 pm
#3
Why not Betzbone with Dr Becker in Freiburg im Breisgau?
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Posted on Jan 3, 2024, 11:59 pm
#4
 Would you or anybody consider  nitrous oxide like arginina?..  not sure if doctor accept it but, I have listen amazing things, it helps to recover the body after gym and increase blood preasure because it make it the vein bigger.. a lot of gym rats used ir for restauration of the body after big fights with the gym
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Posted on Feb 3, 2024, 8:23 pm
#5
Pre-op prep update

Logistics:
The flight and hotel are booked. I've ended the lease for my current apartment. I will be putting whatever I don't take with me in storage as I plan to stay at least 2 months in Athens.

Stretching:
I originally planned to stretch twice a day. It's been hard to sustain that as life gets in the way. Practically I've been able to stretch around 6 times a week.

I've had a lot of success using the PNF technique to increase my range of motion when stretching. By contracting the muscle for 5 seconds when already at your perceived maximum ROM and then relaxing again, you trick your nervous system to go past that ROM.


Sentiment:
It feels surreal that I'm actually be going through with the operation in a few weeks. In about 1/10 days I feel like it's a mistake and I should cancel everything, but in the other 9 days I feel confident in the decision. So averaging it out it's probably still worth going ahead with it Dr. Giotikas 5cm bilateral femurs with G-Nail (detailed) .

While I'm worried about the pain, potential complications, and proportions, my main fear is being too long away from work. I'm not sure how the time away and lower performance when recovering and working remotely will put my employment at risk.

Quote from: Silzz on January 02, 2024, 03:38:49 PMI'll see u there bud. Mine is scheduled for end of Febuary. Gnail femurs as well  Dr. Giotikas 5cm bilateral femurs with G-Nail (detailed)
Hey Silzz, good luck with your operation, see you there!

Quote from: piikachu on January 02, 2024, 04:09:17 PMWhy not Betzbone with Dr Becker in Freiburg im Breisgau?
Dr Becker seems like another great option in Europe. I chose Dr. Giotikas in Athens because the location was convenient and there's an abundance of patient journals here.

Quote from: Rockstarz5 on January 03, 2024, 11:59:10 PM Would you or anybody consider  nitrous oxide like arginina?..  not sure if doctor accept it but, I have listen amazing things, it helps to recover the body after gym and increase blood preasure because it make it the vein bigger.. a lot of gym rats used ir for restauration of the body after big fights with the gym
That wasn't on my radar, thanks for the heads up. I'll look into it and talk to my doctor.
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Posted on Feb 3, 2024, 9:39 pm
#6
Hey man,

just to manage your expectations a bit, walk back to normal after 120 days and rod removal after 360 is very optimistic. I'd say multiply both times two and it will be a more realistic estimate.

Playing tennis 15 days after rod removal won't happen either, I am afraid. It will be 3 - 5 months before you can do intense sports post nail removal, assuming no issues. The main reason is there will be an increased risk of fracture for a few months post nail removal. Because of this 15 days post nail removal you will likely hold crutches in your hands, not a tennis racket.

Sorry to sound a bit negative, but it is important to know what is coming. I had the same expectation as you and when I realised I was wrong that was very frustrating for me and my wife. So please remain optimistic, but do not understimate this procedure. This is very hard and takes a very long time, involving setbacks along the way.

That said, it can be done. All the best! Dr. Giotikas 5cm bilateral femurs with G-Nail (detailed)
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Posted on Feb 4, 2024, 7:45 am
#7
Quote from: DonBones on February 03, 2024, 09:39:33 PMHey man,

just to manage your expectations a bit, walk back to normal after 120 days and rod removal after 360 is very optimistic. I'd say multiply both times two and it will be a more realistic estimate.

Playing tennis 15 days after rod removal won't happen either, I am afraid. It will be 3 - 5 months before you can do intense sports post nail removal, assuming no issues. The main reason is there will be an increased risk of fracture for a few months post nail removal. Because of this 15 days post nail removal you will likely hold crutches in your hands, not a tennis racket.

Sorry to sound a bit negative, but it is important to know what is coming. I had the same expectation as you and when I realised I was wrong that was very frustrating for me and my wife. So please remain optimistic, but do not understimate this procedure. This is very hard and takes a very long time, involving setbacks along the way.

That said, it can be done. All the best! Dr. Giotikas 5cm bilateral femurs with G-Nail (detailed)

Nah!...I do take your point but he is only lengthening 5 cm so I think his numbers should be doable .
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Posted on Mar 26, 2024, 4:59 pm
#8
Pre-surgery update

Tomorrow is the big day. I had a pre-surgery meeting with Giotikas and his team. I'm really impressed with the professionalism and empathy from everyone. Despite having some (healthy) anxiety for tomorrow, the team has made me feel more confident with the operation.

Arrival to Athens
I've enjoyed Athens so far and it's been smooth getting around from the airport to the hotel and the hospital. Looks like there is plenty of food options and the hotel is very comfortable.

Operation
I will be under full anesthesia and receive intrathecal morphine before the ~4-5 hours surgery. They expect me to go to a regular hospital room within 45 min of the surgery being completed. I'll be staying 3 nights in the hospital before coming back to the hotel. Dr. G has approved the larger nail size, which hopefully results in a more stable recovery.

Supplementation plan

Straight after surgery
  • Whey protein (protein)
  • Collagen (protein, soft tissue)
  • Glucosamine (joints and soft tissue)
  • Turmeric Curcurmin (anti-inflammatory)
  • Multi-vitamin (zinc, selenium, Bs, etc)
  • Magnesium Bisglycinate and Melatonin (sleep)

    1 week after surgery:
    • Continue with the above
    • Omega-3
    • L-arginine (improved bloodflow)


    Here's a pic of the whole kit  Dr. Giotikas 5cm bilateral femurs with G-Nail (detailed)
    Dr. Giotikas 5cm bilateral femurs with G-Nail (detailed)

    Height goal
    I am still keeping the target at 5cm, but after more research and speaking to patients I am flexible (pun intended) to go up to 5.7cm if the recovery process goes well.

    Cyborg4life (Victor) session
    I booked an hour session with C4L  a few weeks ago and it was immensely helpful -- definitely recommend. He gave me insights about how to optimize recovery and shared some real patient experiences with my doctor.

    Quote from: DonBones on February 03, 2024, 09:39:33 PMHey man,

    just to manage your expectations a bit, walk back to normal after 120 days and rod removal after 360 is very optimistic. I'd say multiply both times two and it will be a more realistic estimate.

    Playing tennis 15 days after rod removal won't happen either, I am afraid. It will be 3 - 5 months before you can do intense sports post nail removal, assuming no issues. The main reason is there will be an increased risk of fracture for a few months post nail removal. Because of this 15 days post nail removal you will likely hold crutches in your hands, not a tennis racket.

    Sorry to sound a bit negative, but it is important to know what is coming. I had the same expectation as you and when I realised I was wrong that was very frustrating for me and my wife. So please remain optimistic, but do not understimate this procedure. This is very hard and takes a very long time, involving setbacks along the way.

    That said, it can be done. All the best! Dr. Giotikas 5cm bilateral femurs with G-Nail (detailed)

    Thanks for this, it's helpful to hear a different perspective. I've checked the post-rod removal concern with the doctor, and it you're right it will take way longer than 15 days. 120 days to go back to walking is optimistic, but a possible goal. You've given me more motivation to focus on physio to prove you wrong Dr. Giotikas 5cm bilateral femurs with G-Nail (detailed)[/list]
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    Posted on Mar 26, 2024, 5:40 pm
    #9
    Hello good luck ! I Hope it will be fine.
    Why just 5,7 cm ?
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    Posted on Mar 28, 2024, 12:40 pm
    #10
    Post-surgery update

    The surgery
    After arriving early at the hospital, I had my pre-surgery preparations and some medicine to ease the nerves. I got to meet the operating team as they brought me into the OR prior to surgery. The surgery itself was successful, lasting 4-5 hours in total with the actual the operation taking ~3 hours.

    After waking up in the recovery room without any pain, Dr. Giotikas demonstrated that the nail was working correctly by clicking each leg before taking me to a private room where I'll stay for 3 nights.
    Dr. Giotikas 5cm bilateral femurs with G-Nail (detailed)
    The private hospital room

    Initial recovery
    In the hospital room, I've been constantly visited by nurses to give me pain killers, antibiotics and medicine to prevent nausea. My pain has been 0/10 when still and 2/10 on the wounds when stretching. I have no muscular pain whatsoever 26 hours after the surgery -- I guess I'm one of the lucky ones for now. I've also been lucid the whole time (~90% of normal), so they didn't overdo-it on the anesthesia. I could probably work for 4+ hours a day remotely which is reassuring.

    After the surgery, I've had some mild fever (37.5oC) and what looks like an allergic reaction probably from the antibiotics. After receiving some anti-allergy medication (Cortisone) those symptoms went away.

    I had a catheter for the first night, but it was removed in the following morning.

    Dr. Giotika's physical therapist has given me compression socks and stretches to do every 45 minutes. We also practiced with the walker and I am now able to go independently to the bathroom, despite having some instability on lateral movements of my leg. I've had one or two accidental clicks on my left leg, but I was told it's nothing to be concerned about. I'm very happy with the service from the physio, Dr G., and the nursing staff.

    Hobbling around on my walker: https://imgur.com/a/P0HilZY (excuse my piss bag)

    I expected to receive anticoagulant injections in my stomach last night, but it wasn't administered yet. I'll ask the doctor to give me them today.

    The food is pretty decent, and after asking for more protein they have started giving me eggs with every meal. I've also started drinking Whey protein and collagen despite not being recommended to do so Dr. Giotikas 5cm bilateral femurs with G-Nail (detailed).

    Sleep
    Sleep has been relatively good, though it was intermittent as I was woken up by a steady stream of nurses during the night. Having ear plugs and a sleep mask has really helped.

    Next steps (hah)
    There's no much action happening right now, I'm playing the waiting game. The next key milestones are:
    • Tomorrow (3rd day after surgery) I'll be able to walk one foot at a time with the walker.
    • On Saturday (4th day after surgery) I'll be discharged to go back to the hotel
    • Next Tuesday (7th day after surgery) I'll start clicking and going to physical therapy.
    • Every two weeks I will take an x-ray to track my progress

    Upcoming challenges
    I've heard that lengthening the first 3cms is challenging, with some patients having to click under pain killers. I'll do my best to reduce inflammation in these early days and hopefully I'll click without much pain.

    Quote from: Azerty12 on March 26, 2024, 05:40:56 PMHello good luck ! I Hope it will be fine.
    Why just 5,7 cm ?
    Four main reasons:
    1) Maintaining athletic ability is very important to me.
    2) I already have long femurs compared to my tibias.
    3) If I ever decide to do tibial lengthening, increasing the femur beyond 6cm would result in a wonky leg-to-torso ratio
    4) I want to get back to walking as soon as possible.
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