Quote from: Dameon on September 27, 2013, 08:58:14 PMQuote from: An_Apple_A_Day on September 27, 2013, 06:44:05 PMI think you should think very hard about what some users are planning to do on this forum. There is a lot of hate circulating and people are suggesting going to extreme lengths (threats of violence, national news, posting personal information, etc...) How is any of this beneficial to any of us as potential leg lengthening patients?
I am keeping neutral in all of this as much as possible but I feel as a forum LL Forum is getting off on the wrong foot big time. Whatever has happened on old forum it is still the biggest site on the net for information about LL. There are thousands of posts from thousands of users. If SysOp pulls the plug we all lose that. If this gets on national news because some nut job attacks SysOp or reports the old forum site, WE ALL GET HARMED. Plus you can bet this new forum will be dragged through the mud as a result and we will all look like delusional psychotics.
Currently of the 15 or so posts on this forum 6 are bitch fests about old forum or the members. Who gives a ? Just roll it into one thread and let the rest of the forum grow into the knowledge base it should be. Seeing the users act like complete children does not look good at all. There isn't even a single completed diary on here yet.
LL Forum has about 8 years to catch up on, this can be done by structuring the site in such as a way as to provide excellent LL knowledge through decent research and doctor consultations backed up by patient diaries one by one as members do the surgery.
It is very hard to take this forum seriously in it's present state.
Well my opinion is that alot of the negative emotions are understandable, considering what was exposed about Make Me Taller's owner, his actions and agenda. It's natural that people are upset or angry when they felt lied to, considering all the money and risks involved in the surgery.
It's entirely their own decisions if they wish to take action via legal or media outlets. Also don't take everything you read literally on the internet when it comes to promise of violence.
Do I feel Apotheosis should be accountable? Yes, it's a matter of principle and the bigger picture. If more people are aware that there are potential traps in LL industry, then it helps them too.
I'm sorry but you can't convince me on that it is the right thing to keep quiet when something borderline criminal is going on, with people's well-being at risk. Patients are being sent to unqualified doctor because of fake diary with glowing review, just because there's financial reasons to do so.
I think there will be people who love or hate this forum, it's their own choice who to contribute to. I think it's a big pity that Apotheosis has abused all of the trust and credibility built up for his own selfish agenda.
I suppose you meant "ALL GET HARMED" as in more people will be exposed to LL right? Well, Apotheosis already done that with his national interviews. There's no denying that LL is getting more mainstream, you can find reports about it on alot of news outlets.
There are already people archiving old forum since Apotheosis is deleting stuff regularly, I also have confidence that the knowledge and contribution of this community will help patients choose a safe doctor and understand what they are going through.
I think the forum is doing fine, maybe it's too early to write us off after one week?
There's no way we will have diaries all over the place right away, it takes time. Some people were even skeptical about what we actually meant at first. New people are joining and slowly information related to Limb Lengthening is building up.
None of us are being paid to do this full time as a job, so it's a very organic kind of development driven by members. I don't really wish to censor things here, as this is a community driven forum. People can make up their own minds about what they agree or disagree on.
Thank you for the eloquent and well thought out response. I agree with your principles for the most part, and commend your objective approach to discussion. This is what the forum needs.
Yes people will be upset. But you cannot argue that some of the things being posted were taking things too far. In my country at least (the UK) people have been jailed for saying such things online.
By all gets harmed I was referring to extra exposure with NEGATIVE connotations attached. I am aware of SysOp and the 20-20 news broadcast and I was part of the thread that voiced dissatisfaction toward the article. I found out about LL through research. I feel that alone should be one of the qualifying criteria for the surgery. It didn't take me more than a hour or so of Googling about being short to find it, so anyone seriously unhappy about their height should have little problem too. By exposing the corruption to people who have no interest in LL (the general public) all it will do is further compound the stigma attached to the surgery and short men in general (you can view these on any of the LL news stories with a comments section).
In terms of archiving I can't help but feel this is contradictory. People have been saying in this and other threads old forum cannot be trusted yet they are either advising me to archive the site myself or as you have said here people are already doing it. If LL Forum believe old forum to be so biased why are archives being recommended and carried out? From a technical stand point how can this be functional? So far all I have seen is screen grabs which cannot be index or searched.
I am not writing you off, in fact in all of my posts including my very first ones I said it is always good to have alternatives to everything. Even medical professionals advise second opinions. My concerns however is the level of hate the forum is currently harboring. In no way can this be productive.
I understand the organic development and once more commend your initiative on setting up this forum. In regards to prosecuting Apo/SysOp there is no place on old forum where the risks and problems of LL are concealed. I learnt about all the that can happen solely through that site. You might be able to sure the doctor who butchered you, but I doubt very much you could get anything to stick simply because multiple people (Not just Sys) recommend a doctor.
