Quote from: TheDream on January 16, 2024, 09:36:58 PMBut why are you comparing the 12.5 mm from P2.2 with the 10 mm from Pmax? Isn’t that the entire point?
That most short people won’t be able to fit a 12.5 mm precise 2.2 rod so now with the Pmax they get 190 lbs (86 kg) fatigue load per rod at 10 mm instead of the current Precise 2.2 84 lbs (38 kg) fatigue load per 8.5 mm rod or 118 lbs (53 kg) fatigue load per 10.7 mm rod?
For the 12.5 mm precise 2.2 rod the fatigue load was 191 lbs (87 kg) while for the Precise max at 13 mm which is the comparable size it is now 320 lbs (145 kg) fatigue load.
The reason to compare to p2.2 12.5mm nail is because it's not deemed fully weight bearing and has about the same tests results on weight bearing as pMax 10 and 11.5 which highlights how for many pMax 10 will not be fully weight bearing as in you can walk around with just a cane. My posting was never intended as a criticism of pMax. If DanishClown hadn't posted misleadingly about pMax being fully weight bearing for all even at 10mm I'd never have posted in this thread.
Yes, pMax is much better than p2.2. That's why I waited for it. I'll be doing Tibias this year with Paley/Robbins. Yes, I'll be much happier with pMax 10 (or maybe 11.5 if I'm lucky will fit) instead of weaker p2.2
Feels like your pretending I criticized pMax or said it wasn't a big improvement. I didn't do that. I was REALLY wanting to just use a cane after being stuck mostly in a wheelchair when I did Femurs with p2.2 but after emailing with Dr. Robbins I learned I'd still be using a walker. I shouldn't have much needed for a wheelchair after the first week or two.
PMax is great. A huge improvement. However, there will still be many patients needing much more than just a cane to walk around with, myself included 
I agree with dream, that is the huge difference for people like me with small bone canals that can't even fit a 10,7 precice nail.
Well Endgame if I constanly spread misinformation please give some examples besides this according to you? I almost always link sources to everything I spit out. Walking around fully weightbearing and with a cane is in my opinion pretty similiar and still regardless a huge improvement. If the precice 2.2. nail 10,7 was going to fit inside of me, I would have been doing LL right now so please stop your insults for no reason lmao. I still highly doubt that Paley is lying and most people wouldn't able to only use a cane while using the smaller Pmax nails. What is your weight btw? Sounds like your're on the heavier side and is an outlier compared to your bone size... Many people who use the smaller nail sizes also whey less since their bones are smaller... I as an example only whey about 54 KG, mainly because of my smaller size bones... And do you have any kind of proof yourself that your're doing LL with dr Robbins? You could just be talking out of your...
Quote from: DanishViking on January 17, 2024, 10:19:09 AMI agree with dream, that is the huge difference for people like me with small bone canals that can't even fit a 10,7 precice nail.
Well Endgame if I constanly spread misinformation please give some examples besides this according to you? I almost always link sources to everything I spit out. Walking around fully weightbearing and with a cane is in my opinion pretty similiar and still regardless a huge improvement. If the precice 2.2. nail 10,7 was going to fit inside of me, I would have been doing LL right now so please stop your insults for no reason lmao. I still highly doubt that Paley is lying and most people wouldn't able to only use a cane while using the smaller Pmax nails. What is your weight btw? Sounds like your're on the heavier side and is an outlier compared to your bone size... Many people who use the smaller nail sizes also whey less since their bones are smaller... I as an example only whey about 54 KG, mainly because of my smaller size bones... And do you have any kind of proof yourself that your're doing LL with dr Robbins? You could just be talking out of your...
At 54kg that's 119lbs which would make you an outlier on the lighter side. You're a troll trying to get me to dox myself, no thanks lol. Your earlier post didn't qualify the fully weight bearing claim to only for most people. Thank you for correcting your claims in that regard. Maybe over half will be, but as I noted lots of people won't be. Not super likely a 10mm nail fits you fine but 10.7 too big, and there's a 8.5mm p2.2 nail you could've used that's almost as strong as the 10.7, so you didn't need to wait. But if you're actually going to do LL good luck and you'll have a much easier time with the stronger pMax. Which doctor you going with? If it's this summer with Paley we can meet in person and you can get the proof you want.
You didn't answer my question about your weight XD From the research I have done the 8,5 precice nail isn't recommended since it will break way to easily and your're forced in wheelchair for 5 months at least, which is unacceptable to me. The doctor at AFA which also has decades of experience told me that they don't use the 8,5 mm nail ever since he had a tiny 150 cm girl wheying less than me, bending the nail even tho she followed the weightbearing protocol. I would definitly choose Paley if I had the money, however I don't so after visiting AFA i'm thinking about either dr Giotikas, Dr Birkholtz or maybe still AFA, since they where very professional. Which one get's the new nail quickest, so most likely dr Giotikas I think since his operating in the European Union.
Quote from: Kintaeryos on January 14, 2024, 06:57:38 PMIs there a particular reason why LL is so expensive, especially the internal methods?
Less likely to get complications, and much less scarring.
The latter part is very important to me as I do not want to advertise that I got limb lengthening surgery done.
I am an honest person. I will not lie but I don't want people to think right away when they see me
"oh this guy definitely got limb lengthening surgery done."
That is why I plan to get precice over LON.
Precice is superior in every way. It offers a solution which has way less complications, is much more comfortable, but comes at a greater cost. But when we're talking about ones legs cheaping out on them is stupid af.
Quote from: DanishViking on January 18, 2024, 08:33:43 AMPrecice is superior in every way. It offers a solution which has way less complications, is much more comfortable, but comes at a greater cost. But when we're talking about ones legs cheaping out on them is stupid af.
Add full weightbearing too with Precise Max, which eliminates a lot of other problems with post-LL recovery, and it becomes common sense to pursue that for something as serious as LL. I would only consider external methods if I was REALLY struggling with my height, didn't have enough money and needed LL asap.
Will the price of other nails go down with the release of precise max?
Quote from: EndGame on January 17, 2024, 01:38:37 AM
PMax is great. A huge improvement. However, there will still be many patients needing much more than just a cane to walk around with, myself included
Yes I wondered about this too. Paley said they divide the max fatigue load by 2 in order to get the weight bearing capability. So for the 10 mm nail that is 86 kg /2 = 43 kg. For the 13 mm nail that is 145 kg / 2 = 72.5 kg.
Now I know you have one rod per leg. But essentially when walking either just normally or up and down the stairs shouldn’t one leg be able to weightbear your entire weight for that rod to be truely weight bearing?
So a person would have to weigh maximum 43 kg for the 10 mm rod to be weight bearing or alternatively be maximum 72.5 of for the 13 mm rod to be weight bearing, no?
I don’t know how often people of about 170 - 172 cm height will be able to use a 13 mm diameter rod. Is this rare or fairly normal?
Quote from: EndGame on January 16, 2024, 08:27:31 PMLook around 35:47 in the video and you'll see the weight bearing test results. P2.2 12.5mm about the same as pMax 10 and 11.5mm. You've never done LL, likely never will, and you post things that are often wrong or misleading. Perhaps take your own advice and stop posting misinformation? I posted in this thread primarily because your misinformation and prevent your confusion spreading lol. Since I'm going back for another LL I followed up with Paley Institute right after that interview. Dr. Robbins was very clear that patients around my weight with 10 or 11.5mm pMax will not be allowed to walk without using their arms and walker to de weight. Yes, the FDA 50lbs max weight bearing is only a guideline and safe per Paley to do more but that's a far cry from fully weight bearing at 10mm nail for all or even most patients. There's also a difference between fully weight bearing as in you can stand balanced weight equal across both legs and fully weight bearing as in you can safely walk around with just a cane. Please stop spreading misinformation...
Great post, it's always the ones on here who have never gotten the procedure that are extremely opinionated and spread false information. I could not fathom racking up so many posts on a forum about a procedure one will most likely never get. It's unfortunate and worrisome for people who actually got the procedure, or are serious about getting it and are in a financial and lifestyle situation to do so, coming to the forum for research and reading layman's "mental masturbation" that usually constitutes itself in the form of fear-mongering or copium. For those who haven't gotten the surgery, get multiple consultations, take what you hear from doctor's marketing ploys and media tours with a grain of salt, and take what you read on here from people who haven't had the surgery with an even bigger grain of salt.
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