I'm about 169cm, and I come from a country where the average is 173cm. However, I studied in Australia, where I developed a height neurosis over the years due to people being taller where I went. I plan to go home soon.
My goal was to gain 3-4cm. If I could do that, I would be overjoyed, and I think I will genuinely have my height neurosis cured.
When I was first active on this forum 2 months ago, I first wanted internal femurs. But due to high risk of fat embolism and cost of Stryde, I said no. I then wanted to do pure externals. But I don't want 6-8 months of recovery. It's not worth it. I then wanted to do LON tibias. I have enough for Dr Donghoon Lee, along with backup for complications. But no procedure is absolutely safe. A lot of the risks of LL are not just lengthening (which you can control, for example stopping at 2cm if you have to), but surgical. You could get PE, Fat emboli, Compartment syndrome, deep infection, etc. And you will never know how your body will respond to this, until you do it. Do all the research in the world, but some people will have complications, and it could be you.
Then it comes down to how you can estimate risk. There seems to be a lot of misinformation around. Even for the best doctors. People have reported different numbers from Paley regarding his fat emboli occurrence rate. Some articles on this forum have provided competing accounts of true success rates with this surgery. In an article called compendium of outcomes, there are significant numbers of bad outcomes. Maybe they lengthened too much. Maybe they went to a bad doctor. But even if most of them did those things, there will always be some who actually went to a good doctor, and actually did what they were supposed to do. People say some doctors are the best in the world for this. Dr Lee looks like one of the best LON there is. But all doctors are also businessmen. Everyone, even and sometimes especially the best doctors, sell themselves pretty hard and say they are safe. Well sure, by their definition of safe. But I guess I am unsure how to really parse the truth. I will need to do more research here.
Everything else in my life is going well. I will return to a prestigious high powered career. I have a decent personality (not according to me). I am not Brad Pitt but I am maybe 6/10. And I guess I am not even that short in my home country.
Money aside (I would pay 100k if I could gain 4cm with guranteed safety), with everything that could go wrong, especially the risks I can't control (the 9 days after surgery and the way my body reacts to the assault of an extremely invasive surgery and being essentially drowned in painkillers), is this really worth it? I consider 3cm to be really good, 3.5 to 4cm would really kill off any height neurosis I would have (I would be average, what more could I ask for?). I don't care much for athletics. But the risks just seems so poorly defined, and there seems to me to be so much misinformation. I don't expect that I will be one of the good outcomes. I could be that one fluke who got fked up at a good doc with a short lengthening amount. I could have severe arthritis in old age. Catastrophe is a possibility. Why am I interested? The same reason you all are: women. I want to feel validated by being attractive, and this is superficial but I will be honest with you guys.
Sorry this is a long post but I am working through these thoughts. But to people who are considering LL, who have done LL. What is your honest advice for this. Is it worth it? How dangerous is it? Is this all...fking crazy?
The surgery is absolutely safe when done by Dr. Mahboubian, Dr. Paley, and/or Dr. Rozbruch. I'm not sure of other Doctors but there appear to be other reputable doctors doing Stryde. Recovery is not overwhelming and can be accomplished by the non-athletic men and complications levels are very low. In fact, the complication rate of CLL appears to be as low as many other common surgeries out there. 8cm is a safe amount to go it will change your life. I'm not sure of the pricing for all the doctors; but when all was said and done, my cost was about $75,000.
I think you should go forward with it if this is something you're very passionate about and if your height level is dominating your happiness.
Feel free to reach out if you have questions.
All the Best,
IFS
Quote from: tacoma94 on January 03, 2020, 05:51:54 PMEverything else in my life is going well. I will return to a prestigious high powered career. I have a decent personality (not according to me). I am not Brad Pitt but I am maybe 6/10. And I guess I am not even that short in my home country.
Good reasons not to do it, then.
Quote from: InFullStryde on January 03, 2020, 09:42:47 PMthe complication rate of CLL appears to be as low as many other common surgeries out there.
But not zero, and those people are sick. You don't sound sick, tacoma94. Not sick like I was before LL.
I say go back to your country, try to adjust and see If it stil bothers you.
Then consider the next steps
Quote from: tacoma94 on January 03, 2020, 05:51:54 PMI'm about 169cm, and I come from a country where the average is 173cm. However, I studied in Australia, where I developed a height neurosis over the years due to people being taller where I went. I plan to go home soon.
My goal was to gain 3-4cm. If I could do that, I would be overjoyed, and I think I will genuinely have my height neurosis cured.
When I was first active on this forum 2 months ago, I first wanted internal femurs. But due to high risk of fat embolism and cost of Stryde, I said no. I then wanted to do pure externals. But I don't want 6-8 months of recovery. It's not worth it. I then wanted to do LON tibias. I have enough for Dr Donghoon Lee, along with backup for complications. But no procedure is absolutely safe. A lot of the risks of LL are not just lengthening (which you can control, for example stopping at 2cm if you have to), but surgical. You could get PE, Fat emboli, Compartment syndrome, deep infection, etc. And you will never know how your body will respond to this, until you do it. Do all the research in the world, but some people will have complications, and it could be you.
Then it comes down to how you can estimate risk. There seems to be a lot of misinformation around. Even for the best doctors. People have reported different numbers from Paley regarding his fat emboli occurrence rate. Some articles on this forum have provided competing accounts of true success rates with this surgery. In an article called compendium of outcomes, there are significant numbers of bad outcomes. Maybe they lengthened too much. Maybe they went to a bad doctor. But even if most of them did those things, there will always be some who actually went to a good doctor, and actually did what they were supposed to do. People say some doctors are the best in the world for this. Dr Lee looks like one of the best LON there is. But all doctors are also businessmen. Everyone, even and sometimes especially the best doctors, sell themselves pretty hard and say they are safe. Well sure, by their definition of safe. But I guess I am unsure how to really parse the truth. I will need to do more research here.
Everything else in my life is going well. I will return to a prestigious high powered career. I have a decent personality (not according to me). I am not Brad Pitt but I am maybe 6/10. And I guess I am not even that short in my home country.
Money aside (I would pay 100k if I could gain 4cm with guranteed safety), with everything that could go wrong, especially the risks I can't control (the 9 days after surgery and the way my body reacts to the assault of an extremely invasive surgery and being essentially drowned in painkillers), is this really worth it? I consider 3cm to be really good, 3.5 to 4cm would really kill off any height neurosis I would have (I would be average, what more could I ask for?). I don't care much for athletics. But the risks just seems so poorly defined, and there seems to me to be so much misinformation. I don't expect that I will be one of the good outcomes. I could be that one fluke who got fked up at a good doc with a short lengthening amount. I could have severe arthritis in old age. Catastrophe is a possibility. Why am I interested? The same reason you all are: women. I want to feel validated by being attractive, and this is superficial but I will be honest with you guys.
Sorry this is a long post but I am working through these thoughts. But to people who are considering LL, who have done LL. What is your honest advice for this. Is it worth it? How dangerous is it? Is this all...fking crazy?
external tibias are actually the least invasive form of this surgery for people who want to lengthen <5 cm. But US doctors like Paley do not want to do external tibias even though the rates of fat embolism/pulmonary embolism are near 0. Why? The doctors or the insurance companies that pay the doctors are paid off by the company that makes the precise nails (NuVasive).
Yes, internal tibias are easier than external tibias due to not having to wear an external frame.
But I would rather wear an external frame, if it meant lowering the rate of mortality/severe morbidity. Just something to think about...
Always remember medicine is a business. It is just as corrupt as other multi-billion dollar successful corporations
There is death case of External tibia, DVT then developed PE
External is not really the safest
need to find the best doctor possible to lower the chance of complications
Physicians skills are lot more important than methods
There are just too many unskilled doctors doing terrible jobs with externals
Quote from: InFullStryde on January 03, 2020, 09:42:47 PMThe surgery is absolutely safe when done by Dr. Mahboubian, Dr. Paley, and/or Dr. Rozbruch. I'm not sure of other Doctors but there appear to be other reputable doctors doing Stryde. Recovery is not overwhelming and can be accomplished by the non-athletic men and complications levels are very low. In fact, the complication rate of CLL appears to be as low as many other common surgeries out there. 8cm is a safe amount to go it will change your life. I'm not sure of the pricing for all the doctors; but when all was said and done, my cost was about $75,000.
I think you should go forward with it if this is something you're very passionate about and if your height level is dominating your happiness.
Feel free to reach out if you have questions.
All the Best,
IFS
IFS, no offence but in my opinion, you are really misleading future potential patient.
CLL is just the most dangerous cosmetic surgery ever done (no other way to put it). The risk of dying is higher than any other cosmetic surgery , the recovery time way higher, and the long term outcome is just unknown (even by Doctors)
I don't understand how can you say it is absolutely safe as people already died from it (Paley's patient also almost died) and it will happen to the other US doctors, it is just statisitics (a basic information but do you know that even in the US, every 1 out of 400 die from a hospital Acquired Infections ? so the argument of US doctors/hospitals is just not true, every surgery is risky and should always be the very last option for patient)
Regarding the recovery as a non athletic man not being over overwhelming, I am also quite surprised by your statement. Unless mistaken, you took half a year for just walking normal and even after a year post surgery, unless mistaken, you cannot run properly (so even more far away from doing sports!). So basically, your lifestyle is more like a grandpa lifestyle than a healthy young man of 37 years old (your age I believe). So I am really surprised you are saying it is not overwhelming...And once again, doctors have no idea of possible arthiris but if you ask them, they will reply for 8cm : it will probably happen at some points...
I really appreciate you sharing your experience but as I said, according to me, post like the one you just made really underestimate the most dangerous cosmectic surgery out there. And it can definitevely mislead people who are just thinking about it without really having the knowledge to understand this crazy process.
Tacomaca94, I am like you, I really thinking about the procedure but all your concerns are definitevely justified. Thus, I would more listen to advise of Montreal172 and Medium Drink Of Water in this post.
Tacoma94 good on you for putting deep thought into this, you are thinking through CLL in a rational manner. Everyone should reflect deeply into why they are doing CLL and do the proper research and be informed of the risks and costs of this surgery before stepping forward. CLL should be the last resort to addressing height neurosis.
I successfully did 8 CM Stryde femurs with Paley. Having said that, I would only recommend CLL if height neurosis is consuming ones life and one cannot resolve height neurosis through other, less risky means.
CLL is by far the most risky, costly (both time and money), and difficult cosmetic surgery that exists today. It will test you both physically and mentally in ways you could never imagine.
Cases of fat embolism and pulmonary embolism are rare but have happened. Even with Paley. There has been one death that I'm aware of relating to pulmonary embo with Dr. Guichet. Having said that the risk of FE or PE is low with the proper preventative and detective measures, but still exists.
Lengthening your bones and soft tissues will forever change your biomechanics and functionality. At your desired length of 4 cm to a much lesser extent but still a factor to consider. I had a text book successful surgery, maxed out the rod at 8 CM, and am recovering well but many of my LL friends have not had the same fortune - some had to quit early before reaching their goal due to tightness, some had pre consolidation, some had prolonged nerve pain complications.
The sacrifices and opportunity costs are real. You will have to take a break from your career/school to dedicate yourself to this procedure. Some have worked through it but I guarantee they weren't 100%. I had to take a leave of absence from work. Moreso than the financial cost of not having an income while going through this, is the opportunity cost. The same applies to our personal lives. This process will put a strain on any relationship you have and if you are married or have a girlfriend....will be difficult for that person as well. I started to unexpectedly date a co worker before LL, and I had to end that to move forward with LL. This procedure requires you to dedicate yourself to it and put everything else aside.
Having said all that, for me it came down to performing a deep dive risk assessment and weighing the pros and cons.
My height neurosis was deep and had taken over my life. It put a real constraint on living out my purpose as a man, as a friend, as a family member, as a lover, and I needed to address it. I became addicted to shoe lifts and never went out without them. I was living a lie every day I put those on and felt depressed every time I took off my shoes. I declined one of my best friends weddings because it was on a beach w/ a barefoot dress code and I couldn't wear my shoe lifts. My life was no longer logical or rational. Height neurosis had taken a hold of my life and I was determined to change that.
In my case, the pros outweighed the cons and I'm very much happy with the outcome. The benefits of the freedom of height neurosis were in my opinion, greater than the risks and costs of doing this surgery.
I had a textbook successful surgery, maxed out the nail at 8 CM, and am recovering nicely in consolidation. I'm truly blessed and thankful....but still, I would not recommend this surgery until you have done a deep analysis of the risks and sacrifices you will have to make for this surgery. CLL should really be the last resort to addressing your height neurosis. Before moving forward with CLL, I literally drew out a venn diagram of the pros, cons, and risks of doing this. I had a few sessions with a therapist to see if I could address my height heurosis issue through therapy. I tried meditation. I tried different hobbies and lifestyle adjustments. Only until going through this process was I able to make a truly informed decision around doing CLL. This was all in all a 2 year process of me assessing whether this was the right decision before deciding to move forward.
Listen, it's a calculated risk, the risk is still there, pulmonary embo, fat embo, long term complications, you can do preventative and detective work to stack the odds in your favor, but a lot of it is out of your control and you have to leave some of it to fate. It was worth it in the end for me, but that is after some very deep deep reflection into myself and my height neurosis. Good luck my friend!
Quote from: TheAlchemist on January 13, 2020, 05:12:22 PMI had a text book successful surgery, maxed out the rod at 8 CM, and am recovering well but many of my LL friends have not had the same fortune - some had to quit early before reaching their goal due to tightness, some had pre consolidation, some had prolonged nerve pain complications.
Hi TheAlchemist,
What prolonged nerve pain complications did you notice there and how many cases? Did it result in chronic pain? Do you think the Dr. Paley's claims of under 1% complication rate is true?
Thank you
Quote from: cena on January 13, 2020, 06:14:07 PMHi TheAlchemist,
What prolonged nerve pain complications did you notice there and how many cases? Did it result in chronic pain? Do you think the Dr. Paley's claims of under 1% complication rate is true?
Thank you
One friend still has mild nerve issues (slight burning sensation on shin) 2 months into consolidation. I still have minor nerve pains in my shin 1 month into consolidation. I expect these to go away with time.
Dr. Robbins said he had 1 stryde patient who had numbness in one leg over a year out from surgery.
So pretty rare but it happens.
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