The mental illness in the forum

Edit Post

Quote from: Jack1066 on July 05, 2017, 06:03:46 PMOne thing that I have noticed is that some tall families take a lot of pride in their height. I can imagine that the kid who gets the "short" gene (apparently a statistically 1/5 chance) might feel bad about it if their family brings it up a lot. If people are body shaming  a guy for being the "runt of the litter" I can understand how even an objectively tall guy might start to feel ashamed of his body. I grew up in a family of women and have generally been called "big", despite the fact that I'm short for a man and fairly slim, so this isn't a problem I've experienced, but I can empathise.

I remember talking to a kid on the internet who was 5'10" at 15, predicted to grow to 6'6" (late puberty and set for late growth spurts). He said that he would get LL if he didn't reach that height and his family would help him with that.

At this point I tend to agree with BodyBuilder. The neurosis has reached the point where it is not grounded in objective reality. There is the objective reality that while some women do indeed like short men, or that in some professions being short is actually a bonus, for most of us we can reap greater social rewards by being at least average height or taller. But if a guy is already taller than average, is his height really the objective problem, or is it his own insecurities, or the toxic attitudes of some other people surrounding him? I think it's the latter. That's why there's a qualitative difference.

I'm not knocking on anyone above average height who wants to do LL. It is their life after all. But this is just my feeling on the matter- the sacrifices and potential risks are probably not objectively worth it for someone who is already not likely to be considered short statured, and any negatives might well be better compensated for by therapy or moving away from toxic people who define your worth by your length of bone.

 The social rewards of becoming taller than average from average are exagerrated here. It's people who are fixated with height who think that height is so important. It's not once you are average

Edit Post

I agree. Height is not an absolute in itself and is more about aesthetics. It is better to look aesthetically tall and not noticeably tall while maintaining good proportions. I think there's truth in the oft-repeated 5'10"-6'2" range being ideal, maybe that'll bump up an inch or so in the future if people carry on growing. But being shorter than average definitely has bigger and bigger repercussions the shorter you get.

Edit Post

Quote from: Jack1066 on July 05, 2017, 08:14:11 PMI agree. Height is not an absolute in itself and is more about aesthetics. It is better to look aesthetically tall and not noticeably tall while maintaining good proportions. I think there's truth in the oft-repeated 5'10"-6'2" range being ideal, maybe that'll bump up an inch or so in the future if people carry on growing. But being shorter than average definitely has bigger and bigger repercussions the shorter you get.

My 5'7 or your 5'8 aren't that bad. Even at 5'6 you can still be good. It starts to get really bad once you are in the average height for a woman.
 
  Actually from my personal observation the "best" heights are in the 175-180cm range as simply because most guys are in that height range. I am talking about Italy, France and Israel here as I lived in all those areas.
  Also, Having an AirBnB I have had couples from all over europe and the world and only young couples and usually most guys are 175-180cm tall with a few taller guys

Edit Post

There are various height milestones. "Shorter than the average man" is OK (not great, but OK, like 5 on a 1-10 scale) so long as you are still "man height" and not "woman height" (apologies to anyone who is offended by these terms, I don't like them much either).

When you are shorter than the average woman, or the same height, you begin to get a load of microaggressions off people and general bull .

Edit Post

Quote from: Jack1066 on July 05, 2017, 08:43:45 PMThere are various height milestones. "Shorter than the average man" is OK (not great, but OK, like 5 on a 1-10 scale) so long as you are still "man height" and not "woman height" (apologies to anyone who is offended by these terms, I don't like them much either).

When you are shorter than the average woman, or the same height, you begin to get a load of microaggressions off people and general bullcrap.

 It's not great and that's why I think it's ok to want to change it. I don't think it's ok (mentally speaking) to want to change your height if you are average or a little above that. I don't judge anyone who does it as it's their right to do what they want with their body but still, psicologically speaking, something else is at play here if an average height man (or even a 1-2cm shorter than that) suffers so much he is willing to risk his walking to go through such a thing.
  And sadly, this forum has become like R/short with people basically speaking bull  about how much height is important in regards to dating or respect from men or whatever. And even more ridiculus is the fact it's coming from people your height or taller.
  I don't mean to say that height isn't important in regards to dating (in all other aspects it means absolutly nothing) but what I mean is that I find it extremely hard to believe that a 5'7 or a 5'8 guy has an extremely hard time to get dates at those heights

Edit Post

Quote from: TIBIKE200 on July 05, 2017, 08:51:29 PM It's not great and that's why I think it's ok to want to change it. I don't think it's ok (mentally speaking) to want to change your height if you are average or a little above that. I don't judge anyone who does it as it's their right to do what they want with their body but still, psicologically speaking, something else is at play here if an average height man (or even a 1-2cm shorter than that) suffers so much he is willing to risk his walking to go through such a thing.
  And sadly, this forum has become like R/short with people basically speaking bullcrap about how much height is important in regards to dating or respect from men or whatever. And even more ridiculus is the fact it's coming from people your height or taller.
  I don't mean to say that height isn't important in regards to dating (in all other aspects it means absolutly nothing) but what I mean is that I find it extremely hard to believe that a 5'7 or a 5'8 guy has an extremely hard time to get dates at those heights

There are guys at all heights that have problems getting girls. If that's the reason why you want LL, you shouldn't consider it no matter how tall or short you are. There is no cut off height that makes LL wrong or right. A below average height man that wants LL can be just as mentally unstable as a tall guy that wants it. It's too hard to gauge that sitting behind a computer screen.

Edit Post

Quote from: biggerdreams on July 05, 2017, 10:49:47 PMThere are guys at all heights that have problems getting girls. If that's the reason why you want LL, you shouldn't consider it no matter how tall or short you are. There is no cut off height that makes LL wrong or right. A below average height man that wants LL can be just as mentally unstable as a tall guy that wants it. It's too hard to gauge that sitting behind a computer screen.

A taller than average man who wants to do LL is much more possible to be mentally unstable than a short man.
The thing that someone wants to break his legs to fix a problem that doesn't exist make he almost for sure mentally unstable. A short man who does LL to fix an existing problem (lack of height) has of course much more possibilities to be realistic and wise and want to improve something that can't be fixed otherwise.

An anorexic girl who does diet in almost for sure unstable.
An obese girl who does diet is probably sensible and logical.
The same happens with LL and initial height. People who don't want to admit that there is a borded where LL is justified or not are usually the tall ones who are way out of this borded. In other word, the unstable ones.

Edit Post

Quote from: Body Builder on July 05, 2017, 11:47:59 PMA taller than average man who wants to do LL is much more possible to be mentally unstable than a short man.
The thing that someone wants to break his legs to fix a problem that doesn't exist make he almost for sure mentally unstable. A short man who does LL to fix an existing problem (lack of height) has of course much more possibilities to be realistic and wise and want to improve something that can't be fixed otherwise.

An anorexic girl who does diet in almost for sure unstable.
An obese girl who does diet is probably sensible and logical.
The same happens with LL and initial height. People who don't want to admit that there is a borded where LL is justified or not are usually the tall ones who are way out of this borded. In other word, the unstable ones.

But you just told Yves in the other topic that he should definitely go get LL and he is 5'8". That is average height. We have to move beyond personal preference and personal experience before we are constantly dictating what is wrong or right or what is mentally fit or unfit when we are far from qualified to diagnose it.

Edit Post

As I said before, the difference between a problem that is subjective and situationally based and a more or less objective reality is very different. They are both problems with different solutions. The first is therapy, the second is LL. I'm not implying that many of the short guys on here shouldn't go for therapy too...

LL is a real waste and a big mistake if your problems actually are just in your head.

Quote from: biggerdreams on July 05, 2017, 10:49:47 PMThere are guys at all heights that have problems getting girls. If that's the reason why you want LL, you shouldn't consider it no matter how tall or short you are. There is no cut off height that makes LL wrong or right. A below average height man that wants LL can be just as mentally unstable as a tall guy that wants it. It's too hard to gauge that sitting behind a computer screen.

Edit Post

Quote from: biggerdreams on July 06, 2017, 12:08:53 AMBut you just told Yves in the other topic that he should definitely go get LL and he is 5'8". That is average height. We have to move beyond personal preference and personal experience before we are constantly dictating what is wrong or right or what is mentally fit or unfit when we are far from qualified to diagnose it.

I think that Yves is from Europe. 5.8 is not average in eu, especially in my country it is 2.5 inches less.
So no, if someone is 2.5 inches less than average has reasons to do LL and is not considered completely average in no way.
When I say that LL is not suitable for more than average height men I mean for men that have the exactly average height of men in their country, not 2-3 inches less which is generally considered as almost average.