Would you, and under what circumstances, take debt to finance CLL ?

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Quote from: DoingItForMe on February 08, 2016, 11:17:26 PMStop spending so much money trying to impress other people. It's not worth it. Stop relying on other people's approval of you to be happy. Who gives a crap about the people who find you "short". Seriously. I would question the ahole-ness of anyone who would call a 5'9" guy as someone short. I don't believe for a second that going from 5'9" to 6' would be that much of a difference. You list two improvements:

1) Confidence - You do realize that this is all in your head, right? If you really need confidence, you just have to think that you're taller than you really are. Also deriving your confidence from your height is pretty sad. That's because that's not really something to proud of. You should get your confidence from doing great things and getting achievements. When I ask about someone, I don't ask, "Oh, what's his height?" I ask, what does he do or what has he done? People don't care about your height as much as you do or as much as you think they do.

2) Attention from women - You're not getting attention from women at 5'9"? Really? Dude, at 5'9", pretty girls have been talking to me left and right. I admit that it wasn't as much when I was 5'5"-5'6". But you're complaining about being 5'9"? You're doing something else wrong in your life if you can't get quality women at 5'9". I mean, granted, I drive expensive cars. But being in debt is what drives women away, unless you plan on only doing one-night stands for the rest of your life. And as someone who's done that before, I can tell you that eventually it gets old and leaves you feeling empty. It's much more fulfilling to have a deep relationship with one great woman. And by the time you're in your late 20s, having money is way more impressive than being 3" taller. Only thing you'll probably be left out on here is girls who are taller than 5'9" will probably not date you as well as superficial girls who only want to date 6' tall guys. But who cares about that those minority of girls. Let's pretend that you are a white guy who wants to date asian girls. There are a lot of asian girls who only want to date asian guys. Would you get a surgery to become asian? NO! You find the asian girls who do like white guys. So don't don't don't do this surgery for "attention from women". If you want attention from women, get a puppy. Seriously. Get a cute puppy. My puppy gets me a lot of attention from women on the street.

It's not my place to tell you what to do. But as someone who has been through this surgery, I'd say with 100% confidence that this surgery is not worth going into debt for. Your legs will look disproportional. Certain sex positions will be very hard to do because you're not as flexible anymore. I honestly have trouble doing missionary position now. It hurts to have normal sex! It's pretty messed up. My sports skills now suck. My stamina is crap compared to before. I probably shortened my lifespan doing this surgery. I missed out on a lot of fun events and trips with friends because I was in a wheelchair for half a year. I mean, yes, being taller makes me feel better, but there's so many downsides to this surgery as well that puts me in a position to not fully recommend it. And if I added "debt" to one of the downsides, I'd say that it's not worth it anymore. If the pains in my legs don't go away, then I'd also say it's not worth it anymore even if the surgery was free. Keep in mind that I got my surgery around the age that you plan getting it. So don't think these things that happened to me won't happen to you. Even if there's only a small chance of it happening, it's not worth it to gamble your legs like that.

 This

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Quote from: TIBIKE200 on February 08, 2016, 11:23:59 PM This

Yeah, it is very easy for @DoingItForMe to write that now but I am not sure he realizes that his decision to do LL made even less sense for him than for me now (or in 3 years). He had a girlfriend and based on what I read, they were in great terms, had fun, travelled around, he was successful, and made absolutely no sense whatsoever to do LL. 5'6 is not so bad. I have seen videos of people that went from 5'3 to 5'6 or from 5'0 to 5'3 and they claim they would never have done that should they had the final height as original. One can have it all - success&health&relationship at 5'6 (as is the case with @DFM) and one may not have it at 6'0. But once you have it at 5'6, why go with LL ? I am not questioning him, I perfectly understand him, I just want to make the point that I don't understand why he cannot get me. It is more difficult for him to explain why he did LL in his situation than for me to explain why I want to do it now.

With that being said, I wish you , @dointitwithme, the quickiest possible recovery and having things back to normal. I completely agree with you about the debt situation. I need to think that through, you have a point. Maybe I would do it later, at 28-9-30, maybe I could try to borrow more from my parents, we will see, but my desire to do LL now is no more difficult to be justified than yours back then

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Do 3-4cm´s with externals to become 180 and you´ll be fine I guess. You´ll safe a crap ton of money and you´ll probably recover quit well.
At least that´s my plan (If I ever do LL).
Interals are not worth going into debt for the addidtional 3cm´s you´d get compared to the externals.

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Quote from: aspirant185 on February 09, 2016, 12:19:13 AMYeah, it is very easy for @DoingItForMe to write that now but I am not sure he realizes that his decision to do LL made even less sense for him than for me now (or in 3 years). He had a girlfriend and based on what I read, they were in great terms, had fun, travelled around, he was successful, and made absolutely no sense whatsoever to do LL. 5'6 is not so bad. I have seen videos of people that went from 5'3 to 5'6 or from 5'0 to 5'3 and they claim they would never have done that should they had the final height as original. One can have it all - success&health&relationship at 5'6 (as is the case with @DFM) and one may not have it at 6'0. But once you have it at 5'6, why go with LL ? I am not questioning him, I perfectly understand him, I just want to make the point that I don't understand why he cannot get me. It is more difficult for him to explain why he did LL in his situation than for me to explain why I want to do it now.

With that being said, I wish you , @dointitwithme, the quickiest possible recovery and having things back to normal. I completely agree with you about the debt situation. I need to think that through, you have a point. Maybe I would do it later, at 28-9-30, maybe I could try to borrow more from my parents, we will see, but my desire to do LL now is no more difficult to be justified than yours back then

As 5'9 you shouldn't really question a 5'6 guy why he does his surgery. Question yourself first?

If you decided, it's your decision. Weigh it yourself. I actually recommend you to do it since it is in your head already and you won't get away with it, but also read more diaries and see more bad examples with unsatisfactory outcome.

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OP doesn't want to hear any of this. Our community overwhelmingly agrees that he is not fit to do LL at 5'9, and that taking a loan is the worst idea ever.

But what can you say to a guy who has height neurosis and thinks that all his problems can be solved by a few inches? A 5'9 person has to be really fked up in the head to want this surgery.

Talk is cheap and emotions run wild on this forum. If he is serious, he'll save up enough money which will probably take him a decade lol. In several years, I'm sure he'll mellow out 'cuz of how hard it is to save ~80k-100k for a top doctor and maybe realize that being average height isn't the worst thing in the world.

Else, he can just give us the middle finger and choose one of many 5'9 lengthening options in 3rd world countries.

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Quote from: PatientZero on February 09, 2016, 01:11:23 AMOP doesn't want to hear any of this. Our community overwhelmingly agrees that he is not fit to do LL at 5'9, and that taking a loan is the worst idea ever.

But what can you say to a guy who has height neurosis and thinks that all his problems can be solved by a few inches? A 5'9 person has to be really fked up in the head to want this surgery.

Talk is cheap and emotions run wild on this forum. If he is serious, he'll save up enough money which will probably take him a decade lol. In several years, I'm sure he'll mellow out 'cuz of how hard it is to save ~80k-100k for a top doctor and maybe realize that being average height isn't the worst thing in the world.

Else, he can just give us the middle finger and choose one of many 5'9 lengthening options in 3rd world countries.

I totally agree. OP needs to realize that whatever problems he may have with confidence and all other things don't stem from his average height. Adding a few inches isn't worth the risks and the money at 5'9. Taking a loan, also, is a really bad idea before a potentially crippling surgery.

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Since when 175 is the average height for the young (under 30) generations in the Western European countries ?

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Quote from: aspirant185 on February 09, 2016, 12:19:13 AMYeah, it is very easy for @DoingItForMe to write that now but I am not sure he realizes that his decision to do LL made even less sense for him than for me now (or in 3 years). He had a girlfriend and based on what I read, they were in great terms, had fun, travelled around, he was successful, and made absolutely no sense whatsoever to do LL. 5'6 is not so bad. I have seen videos of people that went from 5'3 to 5'6 or from 5'0 to 5'3 and they claim they would never have done that should they had the final height as original. One can have it all - success&health&relationship at 5'6 (as is the case with @DFM) and one may not have it at 6'0. But once you have it at 5'6, why go with LL ? I am not questioning him, I perfectly understand him, I just want to make the point that I don't understand why he cannot get me. It is more difficult for him to explain why he did LL in his situation than for me to explain why I want to do it now.

With that being said, I wish you , @dointitwithme, the quickiest possible recovery and having things back to normal. I completely agree with you about the debt situation. I need to think that through, you have a point. Maybe I would do it later, at 28-9-30, maybe I could try to borrow more from my parents, we will see, but my desire to do LL now is no more difficult to be justified than yours back then

No, I totally get why you want to do this. I was in the same position as you a year ago. People thought I was crazy for wanting this surgery when everything else in my life was so great. And in my mind, I didn't think that there would be much downside and only upside. The money was definitely not an issue. I had plenty of that. Even time-wise, I didn't think 6 months was that bad.

The problem was that I thought that I'd be pain-free by now, because I don't remember reading about permanent pain in the diaries before. Actually there really isn't much follow-up in the diaries after the lengthening period is over. I don't care so much that I'm not as strong as before or as flexible (though I'll miss some of the sex positions), but the problem is that my legs hurt every day. Every-freaking-day. I feel like I have old man legs. I feel like someone punched my legs and they're bruised. Every day feels like "leg day". Every day feels like someone chained a metal ball to my ankles and I can't move them freely. It sucks and it's starting to get to me.

So yea, I get why you want to do it. But make sure you understand the consequences, too. Not just the downsides, but also that the "improvements" might not be that drastic, nor are worth it, nor can't be achieved doing something else like getting a puppy or going to the gym or driving a nice car or being richer than you are now. If you were 5'6", I'd say that the improvements are pretty drastic and you can forget everything I just said, because the surgery might be worth it if it really does mean the difference between dating a 5 and dating a 10. But c'mon, 5'9" isn't that bad. You can still date 10/10 girls at 5'9", no problem. I'm not even that good looking.

If you think about it, you and I are almost exactly in the same position. We're both 5'9". I think 5'10+ is a more ideal height. I can still do tibias to get another 2 inches or so. I have way more than enough money to pay for it. BUT I don't want do it anymore. I was very eager and everything before the femur surgery. I really considered doing tibias afterwards to fix the proportions and to get to my ideal dream height. BUT now that I've been through the process before, I don't want to go through this all over again. It really sucks that badly. No girl is worth going through that much torture. I don't care if this means that I can only date a 9 and not a 10. Give me the 9. No girl is worth this much pain.

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Quote from: DoingItForMe on February 09, 2016, 05:38:06 AMNo, I totally get why you want to do this. I was in the same position as you a year ago. People thought I was crazy for wanting this surgery when everything else in my life was so great. And in my mind, I didn't think that there would be much downside and only upside. The money was definitely not an issue. I had plenty of that. Even time-wise, I didn't think 6 months was that bad.

The problem was that I thought that I'd be pain-free by now, because I don't remember reading about permanent pain in the diaries before. Actually there really isn't much follow-up in the diaries after the lengthening period is over. I don't care so much that I'm not as strong as before or as flexible (though I'll miss some of the sex positions), but the problem is that my legs hurt every day. Every-freaking-day. I feel like I have old man legs. I feel like someone punched my legs and they're bruised. Every day feels like "leg day". Every day feels like someone chained a metal ball to my ankles and I can't move them freely. It sucks and it's starting to get to me.

So yea, I get why you want to do it. But make sure you understand the consequences, too. Not just the downsides, but also that the "improvements" might not be that drastic, nor are worth it, nor can't be achieved doing something else like getting a puppy or going to the gym or driving a nice car or being richer than you are now. If you were 5'6", I'd say that the improvements are pretty drastic and you can forget everything I just said, because the surgery might be worth it if it really does mean the difference between dating a 5 and dating a 10. But c'mon, 5'9" isn't that bad. You can still date 10/10 girls at 5'9", no problem. I'm not even that good looking.

If you think about it, you and I are almost exactly in the same position. We're both 5'9". I think 5'10+ is a more ideal height. I can still do tibias to get another 2 inches or so. I have way more than enough money to pay for it. BUT I don't want do it anymore. I was very eager and everything before the femur surgery. I really considered doing tibias afterwards to fix the proportions and to get to my ideal dream height. BUT now that I've been through the process before, I don't want to go through this all over again. It really sucks that badly. No girl is worth going through that much torture. I don't care if this means that I can only date a 9 and not a 10. Give me the 9. No girl is worth this much pain.

 Will you people stop wth this "Ideal height" crap? Everyone wants to be taller, stronger, better looking, richer, smarter, funnier, sexier and the list can go on forever... There isnt a single trait that has an "Ideal" range. You "improved" one of your traits, be happy with it and move on.
 Still, wish you a good recovery. Maybe all will be better once the rods are out.

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Quote from: DoingItForMe on February 09, 2016, 05:38:06 AMNo, I totally get why you want to do this. I was in the same position as you a year ago. People thought I was crazy for wanting this surgery when everything else in my life was so great. And in my mind, I didn't think that there would be much downside and only upside. The money was definitely not an issue. I had plenty of that. Even time-wise, I didn't think 6 months was that bad.

The problem was that I thought that I'd be pain-free by now, because I don't remember reading about permanent pain in the diaries before. Actually there really isn't much follow-up in the diaries after the lengthening period is over. I don't care so much that I'm not as strong as before or as flexible (though I'll miss some of the sex positions), but the problem is that my legs hurt every day. Every-freaking-day. I feel like I have old man legs. I feel like someone punched my legs and they're bruised. Every day feels like "leg day". Every day feels like someone chained a metal ball to my ankles and I can't move them freely. It sucks and it's starting to get to me.

So yea, I get why you want to do it. But make sure you understand the consequences, too. Not just the downsides, but also that the "improvements" might not be that drastic, nor are worth it, nor can't be achieved doing something else like getting a puppy or going to the gym or driving a nice car or being richer than you are now. If you were 5'6", I'd say that the improvements are pretty drastic and you can forget everything I just said, because the surgery might be worth it if it really does mean the difference between dating a 5 and dating a 10. But c'mon, 5'9" isn't that bad. You can still date 10/10 girls at 5'9", no problem. I'm not even that good looking.

If you think about it, you and I are almost exactly in the same position. We're both 5'9". I think 5'10+ is a more ideal height. I can still do tibias to get another 2 inches or so. I have way more than enough money to pay for it. BUT I don't want do it anymore. I was very eager and everything before the femur surgery. I really considered doing tibias afterwards to fix the proportions and to get to my ideal dream height. BUT now that I've been through the process before, I don't want to go through this all over again. It really sucks that badly. No girl is worth going through that much torture. I don't care if this means that I can only date a 9 and not a 10. Give me the 9. No girl is worth this much pain.

Won't it get better eventually? I doubt the legs-being-bruised feeling will stay for life.